Oral History: Robert Lee Johnson
Subject
Oral History; Community; work; school; segregation; civil rights
Creator
Johnson, Robert Lee.
Date
Contributor
Brian Corrigan
Camille Bennett
Camille Bennett
Rights
Content is intended for education and research purposes. Organizations and individuals seeking to use content for publication must assume all responsibility for identifying and satisfying any claimants of copyright.
Format
MP3; RTF
Language
English
Type
Sound Recording-Nonmusical
Identifier
TMB RCD 9.mp3
TMB RCD 9 Transcript.rtf
TMB RCD 9 Transcript.rtf
Original Format
MP3; RTF
Duration
35:00
Transcription
Florence African American Heritage Project
Sunday, September 17, 2017
Trinity Missionary Baptist Church, Florence Alabama
Interviewers: Brian Corrigan and Camille Bennett
Interviewee: Robert Lee Johnson
B: Just start by saying the date. It's September 17th and we are talking with Mr. Robert Lee Johnson.
R: Right
B: Is that correct? Who is a very young 83 years old. Are you a member of this church?
R: Oh no, no, no. I belonged to St. James Missionary Baptist Church ever since I was a teenager. I belonged to another church before I met Trevor (Reverend Crenshaw of Trinity MB Church).
C: Ok. Mr. Johnson, what has been your line of work?
R: All my life, I've been barbering. I mean I've had odds and ends jobs like chopping cotton and taking papers, but I was still cutting hair all the time I was doing that.
C: So when did you start cutting hair?
R: I started cutting my brothers' hair, I couldn't have been no older than 10. There was four boys in all, and my father said he wasn't going to be cutting all four boys' hair. He said, 'that's your job.' So that's how I got started really, cutting my brothers' hair.
B: So he was your guinea pig, huh?
R: Yeah, cause I couldn't even cut. I enjoyed messing him up. I messed them up for over a year (laughs). Then I finally started learning, then I messed them up on purpose, I loved it (laughs).
C: So you started when you were 10, when did you start doing it professionally as a job?
R: Well I started cutting their hair, and I started cutting them so good after I quit messing them up that I gained customers from the community. I got 10 cents from the boys and 25 cents for adults. I got so good that they'd come to me and wouldn't want to go to the barber shop, cause the barber shop was higher (priced).
C: What year was this?
R: If I was 10 years old, and I'm 83 now, how many years ago that been? That'd be 70 some years ago
C: Did you ever open up your own barbershop?
R: No I cut at Eddie's shop, and all the time I was cutting I didn't own my own shop because when I got a real barbershop, my money got away from me.
C: Where were you cutting hair?
R: I went to a barber that had a shop, and he saw the haircuts (that I'd been doing for people in the community) and he wanted to know where I'd learned to cut hair. And the barber (saw how good I was) and that's how I got started in a shop.
B: This is in Florence right?
R: Yes. This guy was running a shop, but it was somebody else's shop, and that's how I start cutting hair. He was getting a percentage out of every haircut. I think he was getting forty cents out of every dollar I cut. And that's how I started.
C: So you started there, and you did that for how many years?
R: I didn't do that dollar thing for too many years. I started a family. I got a child, and then I got another child, and I went to the owner of the business that I cut in, and I said 'I'm tired of giving you a percentage of my money, when I'd rather pay you.' And that's how I started making my money, by paying him.
C: Kind of like a booth rental, like you're renting your space.
R: Yeah, you know when you're starting out you really don't know. But after a while you can tell where your money is going. I made real good money, I have made over one thousand dollars a week. It was business, it was business back then. But that was like a peak. But I cut over $600 or $700 a week for many, many years.
C: So during this time Florence was segregated?
R: I don't know what year it was when you could go to white shops. See I started cutting white peoples' hair after many years, and they started coming to my shop. I was so good (laughs).
B: Where was your shop?
R: It was on Mobile, I stayed on Mobile I don't know how many years.
C: Can you tell us what it was like during segregation for you?
R: Well by me just being on the black side, I didn't see much segregation because I wasn't around anybody but black folks, til they (whites) started coming to my shop.
C: What about if you had to do any shopping or anything, what was it like at Florence at that time?
R: Well, if you...after work if I had to go shopping, that's when I had a hard time, cause I would have to go and meet these (white) people. Like if I was getting my clothes from the cleaners, and I got there before a white, I would have to wait to get my clothes. I never did like that, cause I wasn't used to it. Cause I would always be at my shop, and I wouldn't see it and then somebody would do it to me, it offended me. I did a lot of straightening things out myself, tell you the truth (laughs). Cause I couldn't stand to be mistreated.
C: Did you ever say anything if you were mistreated?
R: I hate to tell it, my attitude wasn't too good you know.
C: Tell it, I want to hear it.
R: Oh, you do?
C: Yeah, I do. We don't hear this much, growing up here, what it was like.
R: Like me and the wife go out to eat. And we ate, and we wanted some dessert, and I went into the dessert place to get some dessert. And the lady kept—every time somebody would come in, she would put them in front of me. I said, ‘Hey lady, you done put two or three people in front of me, I was here before all of them.’ She said, ‘well I didn’t notice.’ I said, ‘oh you noticed it.’ So I told my wife, since this is food, I’m not going to argue with the lady and call her a liar, we’re just gonna leave.
C: So you could go into the place though?
R: Yeah you could go in, it might have been already integrated, I might be talking too fast. Now when it was really segregated, you couldn’t go into places, if that’s what you want to hear.
C: I want to hear all of it. I want to hear from when you couldn’t go in, to when you could go in.
R: Well when I couldn’t go in, they had a side where the blacks could go in. And the whites went in their (entrance). I remember that (for restaurants). I couldn’t go in where they (whites) went in. I could go in a side for the blacks.
B: But could you eat in the same restaurant?
R: I couldn’t eat in there. You could see the white people, but they had it partitioned off.
C: Do you remember people in the community complaining about it being that way, or saying we don’t like this or anything like that?
R: Well that was just for you and that didn’t bother me, you know just going in my side. What bothered me was when I went in my side and then they put folks in front of me. So when you could go into places (where whites were) then you caught the devil then. I caught more devil with that (integrated spaces) than I did in my spot (segregated spaces).
C: So during segregation times, do you feel like black people were happy with the way it was.
R: Well before you got your, I call them your rights, when you could go where you want to go. When I knew that I couldn’t go there, I accepted it. See if you got a side for you, you don’t buck that. I just went where I was supposed to go. When you could go wherever, that’s when you (got into trouble). When you were on your side, they were nice to you.
C: So when you went to school I’m assuming it was segregated?
R: You couldn’t go to nothing but your school.
C: Did you ever have to go with white people?
R: No my kids did that.
B: What schools did you go to?
R: When I was young, we were in the rural area. My dad moved me up in the city when I was about 10, right about when I started cutting hair. Well that was just a regular black school, and that’s all I ever went to cause segregation was still there when I started a family.
C: When you found out that you got your rights, did you feel happy?
R: Yeah I felt happy. It took mighty long for me (to feel like) I could go where I wanted to go. But after I started to go where I wanted to go, that’s when I started kissing the devil, though. I caught more devil after I was older, and knew I was being mistreated. I never was aggravated (in segregation).
B: Do you think that white people treated black people worse after segregation ended?
R: Yeah they did, cause there wasn’t no problem as long as we was segregated, it wasn’t no big thing.
B: People resented the change, and maybe that’s why they treated you (worse)
R: Yeah and we were happy to have it, but you don’t enjoy it when people are messing with you.
C: So it wasn’t a smooth transition, they didn’t come in and say, ‘welcome.’
R: Noooo! They got real ugly. If you went to a place to get your clothes (dry-cleaned) they put everybody white before you, (even if) you got there before them, that’s the way they’d do you. That’s what they did to just about all blacks.
C: What year would you say this was, the 60s, the 70s?
B: I did the math and 1934is when I think you were born...
R: Right
B: ...So you would’ve been in high school in the early 1950s, so it would have been segregated then.
R: Yeah it was segregated. When we got out rights—in desegregation, thats when the problems started for me.
B: What about your kids, you said that your kids went to school during integration
R: Right
B: Do you remember them having difficulties with that?
R: They didn’t tell me. When they first started, it was segregated. But they just went on. You know they had a little problem, but not enough to upset me.
B: Were they in school when that happened?
R: Well I got younger kids and older kids, and the older kids they went to school when it was segregated, but when they were about 7 or 8 that’s when they started going to the white school (integration).
B: I know there was a black high school in Florence
R: Yeah that’s where I went.
B: So you went to the original building?
R: Yeah the old building (on Court St at site of present Hampton Inn). It burned down, that’s when I was a little older then. I was ready to come out when it burned. No, I had come out. I was cutting hair then.
I remember when they burned it down.
B: So you went to school in that building before it burned down?
R: Yeah and the other school that was torn down.
C: When you said you caught the devil after segregation...do you think that maybe you wished that segregation hadn’t ended when you saw how things were?
R: I didn’t think about that, I just thought about getting my rights. I mean I like the idea of you can go where you want. But I was satisfied with the way it was before, because I was used to just not being free. And after I got my rights, I got them but I ain’t got them so that’s where the problem starts.
B: Do you think that some of that was because you were growing up and more aware of what your rights were?
R: Yeah. I felt like if I have a right to come in and spend my money, why are you going to put everybody in front of me?
C: Did you ever talk to other people in the community and did other people have problems too?
R: Yeah we talked about it. But some people could take more than others, and if you could take it you could get along better.
B: Was there a civil rights movement in Florence, Alabama?
R: I guess when they got that bill passed and they allowed us to go into all these places. But a lot of times you’d get treated right and sometimes you wouldn’t. Cause I would take my family out to eat, and some of the white people would just get up and leave.
C: When Dr. King was marching in places like Birmingham to try to get their rights, did anything like that happen in Florence?
R: I can’t remember King. But I remember when they got their rights, I remember the first black coming to UNA. And he was accepted. I and appreciated them acting that way cause when something big happened, then they kind of shied back.
B: Was that a big deal, when UNA admitted its first black student?
R: It wasn’t no big deal, they accepted him just like that. I said, ‘my oh my, there’s got to be something to this.’ They didn’t want the adversity, and they accepted him just like that. I cut his hair, he started getting me to cut his hair. (He was) from another town, I forget what town it was but he came to the shop and told me how nice everybody was to him. I just couldn’t believe it! It was like he was white! And I talked to him for years while he went there, and he got it big to cause he got an education and he got to be big, and I stayed in contact with him for years. And he didn’t have no problem here and then we he finished he didn’t have no problem and he got a real good job and everything. A high-paying job cause he went for something—he was smart anyway
C: So during this time, there were no marches here in Florence?
R: I remember marching one time, and I decided to get out. Cause people started meddling with me, and they said if somebody hits you, you’re supposed to take it and I couldn’t do that.
C: That’s true you’re supposed to be non-violent
R: See I couldn’t be non-violent if somebody is hitting me.
C: So there was a march here?
R: Oh yeah, there was a march. And the preacher that was non-violent, they tell you if you can’t stand to be hit, kicked, spit on, (don’t come) and I quit.
B: So you had a preacher that was preaching non-violence?
R: It was the church next to mine. I lived on the west side, and I went to St. James. This was a preacher that preached at Mt. Moriah, just about a block away. He was the one who was heading these marches up.
C: I didn’t know there were marches here!
R: Oh yeah, but I didn’t march in but one, maybe two. But yeah there were a lot of them. Let me see if I can remember how many marches it was cause it was quite a few. Cause I would go and look at them. I don’t remember anything happening though, you know. They just marched. But they would tell you before you marched that you have to be able to accept this. It wasn’t a whole lot of people didn’t march, there was more marching than was in the crowd.
C: Do you remember anybody meddling?
R: I never did see that. But I wanted it to go right and smooth. A person like me would mess that up, so I didn’t want to mess that up. And I don’t ever remember anybody getting hit or kicked or spit on.
C: But it wasn’t like in Birmingham with dogs and fire hoses?
R: That didn’t happen here.
B: Where were these marches?
R: they marched down Court Street, the main drag.
B: So at that time, you could go in the same restaurant as white people but had to go in a different door?
R: When they were marching, I think we could go anywhere. Cause I think King had gotten the right for black people to go anywhere, but something didn’t go right so they were still marching, or something like that. I remember the marches, we were supposed to go where we want to at that time.
When I played football down there at the Coffee Stadium, we had to clean up before we could play.We had to play after they (UNA and Coffee High School) played, we couldn’t play when we wanted to. We played after Coffee and UNA. We were welcome to play but we had to go and clean it up. But I enjoyed cleaning up cause I could be out of class.
C: I just have one last question, so what do you think about the way things are now for black people in Florence?
R: Well you know my daughter, and this really shocked me, just like the people was when I was young...my daughter is catching some of the same stuff (that I got in trouble with) now. My daughter told me—she went to college, I have 2 daughters that finished college—and they got good jobs, but they still pulling crooked, and that kind of hurt me. See when I was cutting hair, I bought a nice home out where I’m living now, about 50 years ago, still living in it now. My daughters have been to college, and they haven’t even bought a home. I didn’t even go to school for barbering, and i bought a house. It would cost over $100,000 now. I have 5 kids and don’t any of them own their own homes. Cause after they got their rights, they couldn’t keep good jobs. I know one of my daughters is highly educated, and she would make about $40/hour if she could stay on the job. But they get rid of her. I got five kids, and those kids don’t even have a home. They rent. I’m talking about they got an education. They know how to not let you work. I thought when my kids finished college, that they would bypass me, with the education and the money they make. But they won’t let them make it long.
B: The only thing left I wanted to ask you is, what was the name of the preacher who was preaching non-violence and leading the marches?
R: Reverend Tolbert, he pastored Mt. Moriah
END OF INTERVIEW
Sunday, September 17, 2017
Trinity Missionary Baptist Church, Florence Alabama
Interviewers: Brian Corrigan and Camille Bennett
Interviewee: Robert Lee Johnson
B: Just start by saying the date. It's September 17th and we are talking with Mr. Robert Lee Johnson.
R: Right
B: Is that correct? Who is a very young 83 years old. Are you a member of this church?
R: Oh no, no, no. I belonged to St. James Missionary Baptist Church ever since I was a teenager. I belonged to another church before I met Trevor (Reverend Crenshaw of Trinity MB Church).
C: Ok. Mr. Johnson, what has been your line of work?
R: All my life, I've been barbering. I mean I've had odds and ends jobs like chopping cotton and taking papers, but I was still cutting hair all the time I was doing that.
C: So when did you start cutting hair?
R: I started cutting my brothers' hair, I couldn't have been no older than 10. There was four boys in all, and my father said he wasn't going to be cutting all four boys' hair. He said, 'that's your job.' So that's how I got started really, cutting my brothers' hair.
B: So he was your guinea pig, huh?
R: Yeah, cause I couldn't even cut. I enjoyed messing him up. I messed them up for over a year (laughs). Then I finally started learning, then I messed them up on purpose, I loved it (laughs).
C: So you started when you were 10, when did you start doing it professionally as a job?
R: Well I started cutting their hair, and I started cutting them so good after I quit messing them up that I gained customers from the community. I got 10 cents from the boys and 25 cents for adults. I got so good that they'd come to me and wouldn't want to go to the barber shop, cause the barber shop was higher (priced).
C: What year was this?
R: If I was 10 years old, and I'm 83 now, how many years ago that been? That'd be 70 some years ago
C: Did you ever open up your own barbershop?
R: No I cut at Eddie's shop, and all the time I was cutting I didn't own my own shop because when I got a real barbershop, my money got away from me.
C: Where were you cutting hair?
R: I went to a barber that had a shop, and he saw the haircuts (that I'd been doing for people in the community) and he wanted to know where I'd learned to cut hair. And the barber (saw how good I was) and that's how I got started in a shop.
B: This is in Florence right?
R: Yes. This guy was running a shop, but it was somebody else's shop, and that's how I start cutting hair. He was getting a percentage out of every haircut. I think he was getting forty cents out of every dollar I cut. And that's how I started.
C: So you started there, and you did that for how many years?
R: I didn't do that dollar thing for too many years. I started a family. I got a child, and then I got another child, and I went to the owner of the business that I cut in, and I said 'I'm tired of giving you a percentage of my money, when I'd rather pay you.' And that's how I started making my money, by paying him.
C: Kind of like a booth rental, like you're renting your space.
R: Yeah, you know when you're starting out you really don't know. But after a while you can tell where your money is going. I made real good money, I have made over one thousand dollars a week. It was business, it was business back then. But that was like a peak. But I cut over $600 or $700 a week for many, many years.
C: So during this time Florence was segregated?
R: I don't know what year it was when you could go to white shops. See I started cutting white peoples' hair after many years, and they started coming to my shop. I was so good (laughs).
B: Where was your shop?
R: It was on Mobile, I stayed on Mobile I don't know how many years.
C: Can you tell us what it was like during segregation for you?
R: Well by me just being on the black side, I didn't see much segregation because I wasn't around anybody but black folks, til they (whites) started coming to my shop.
C: What about if you had to do any shopping or anything, what was it like at Florence at that time?
R: Well, if you...after work if I had to go shopping, that's when I had a hard time, cause I would have to go and meet these (white) people. Like if I was getting my clothes from the cleaners, and I got there before a white, I would have to wait to get my clothes. I never did like that, cause I wasn't used to it. Cause I would always be at my shop, and I wouldn't see it and then somebody would do it to me, it offended me. I did a lot of straightening things out myself, tell you the truth (laughs). Cause I couldn't stand to be mistreated.
C: Did you ever say anything if you were mistreated?
R: I hate to tell it, my attitude wasn't too good you know.
C: Tell it, I want to hear it.
R: Oh, you do?
C: Yeah, I do. We don't hear this much, growing up here, what it was like.
R: Like me and the wife go out to eat. And we ate, and we wanted some dessert, and I went into the dessert place to get some dessert. And the lady kept—every time somebody would come in, she would put them in front of me. I said, ‘Hey lady, you done put two or three people in front of me, I was here before all of them.’ She said, ‘well I didn’t notice.’ I said, ‘oh you noticed it.’ So I told my wife, since this is food, I’m not going to argue with the lady and call her a liar, we’re just gonna leave.
C: So you could go into the place though?
R: Yeah you could go in, it might have been already integrated, I might be talking too fast. Now when it was really segregated, you couldn’t go into places, if that’s what you want to hear.
C: I want to hear all of it. I want to hear from when you couldn’t go in, to when you could go in.
R: Well when I couldn’t go in, they had a side where the blacks could go in. And the whites went in their (entrance). I remember that (for restaurants). I couldn’t go in where they (whites) went in. I could go in a side for the blacks.
B: But could you eat in the same restaurant?
R: I couldn’t eat in there. You could see the white people, but they had it partitioned off.
C: Do you remember people in the community complaining about it being that way, or saying we don’t like this or anything like that?
R: Well that was just for you and that didn’t bother me, you know just going in my side. What bothered me was when I went in my side and then they put folks in front of me. So when you could go into places (where whites were) then you caught the devil then. I caught more devil with that (integrated spaces) than I did in my spot (segregated spaces).
C: So during segregation times, do you feel like black people were happy with the way it was.
R: Well before you got your, I call them your rights, when you could go where you want to go. When I knew that I couldn’t go there, I accepted it. See if you got a side for you, you don’t buck that. I just went where I was supposed to go. When you could go wherever, that’s when you (got into trouble). When you were on your side, they were nice to you.
C: So when you went to school I’m assuming it was segregated?
R: You couldn’t go to nothing but your school.
C: Did you ever have to go with white people?
R: No my kids did that.
B: What schools did you go to?
R: When I was young, we were in the rural area. My dad moved me up in the city when I was about 10, right about when I started cutting hair. Well that was just a regular black school, and that’s all I ever went to cause segregation was still there when I started a family.
C: When you found out that you got your rights, did you feel happy?
R: Yeah I felt happy. It took mighty long for me (to feel like) I could go where I wanted to go. But after I started to go where I wanted to go, that’s when I started kissing the devil, though. I caught more devil after I was older, and knew I was being mistreated. I never was aggravated (in segregation).
B: Do you think that white people treated black people worse after segregation ended?
R: Yeah they did, cause there wasn’t no problem as long as we was segregated, it wasn’t no big thing.
B: People resented the change, and maybe that’s why they treated you (worse)
R: Yeah and we were happy to have it, but you don’t enjoy it when people are messing with you.
C: So it wasn’t a smooth transition, they didn’t come in and say, ‘welcome.’
R: Noooo! They got real ugly. If you went to a place to get your clothes (dry-cleaned) they put everybody white before you, (even if) you got there before them, that’s the way they’d do you. That’s what they did to just about all blacks.
C: What year would you say this was, the 60s, the 70s?
B: I did the math and 1934is when I think you were born...
R: Right
B: ...So you would’ve been in high school in the early 1950s, so it would have been segregated then.
R: Yeah it was segregated. When we got out rights—in desegregation, thats when the problems started for me.
B: What about your kids, you said that your kids went to school during integration
R: Right
B: Do you remember them having difficulties with that?
R: They didn’t tell me. When they first started, it was segregated. But they just went on. You know they had a little problem, but not enough to upset me.
B: Were they in school when that happened?
R: Well I got younger kids and older kids, and the older kids they went to school when it was segregated, but when they were about 7 or 8 that’s when they started going to the white school (integration).
B: I know there was a black high school in Florence
R: Yeah that’s where I went.
B: So you went to the original building?
R: Yeah the old building (on Court St at site of present Hampton Inn). It burned down, that’s when I was a little older then. I was ready to come out when it burned. No, I had come out. I was cutting hair then.
I remember when they burned it down.
B: So you went to school in that building before it burned down?
R: Yeah and the other school that was torn down.
C: When you said you caught the devil after segregation...do you think that maybe you wished that segregation hadn’t ended when you saw how things were?
R: I didn’t think about that, I just thought about getting my rights. I mean I like the idea of you can go where you want. But I was satisfied with the way it was before, because I was used to just not being free. And after I got my rights, I got them but I ain’t got them so that’s where the problem starts.
B: Do you think that some of that was because you were growing up and more aware of what your rights were?
R: Yeah. I felt like if I have a right to come in and spend my money, why are you going to put everybody in front of me?
C: Did you ever talk to other people in the community and did other people have problems too?
R: Yeah we talked about it. But some people could take more than others, and if you could take it you could get along better.
B: Was there a civil rights movement in Florence, Alabama?
R: I guess when they got that bill passed and they allowed us to go into all these places. But a lot of times you’d get treated right and sometimes you wouldn’t. Cause I would take my family out to eat, and some of the white people would just get up and leave.
C: When Dr. King was marching in places like Birmingham to try to get their rights, did anything like that happen in Florence?
R: I can’t remember King. But I remember when they got their rights, I remember the first black coming to UNA. And he was accepted. I and appreciated them acting that way cause when something big happened, then they kind of shied back.
B: Was that a big deal, when UNA admitted its first black student?
R: It wasn’t no big deal, they accepted him just like that. I said, ‘my oh my, there’s got to be something to this.’ They didn’t want the adversity, and they accepted him just like that. I cut his hair, he started getting me to cut his hair. (He was) from another town, I forget what town it was but he came to the shop and told me how nice everybody was to him. I just couldn’t believe it! It was like he was white! And I talked to him for years while he went there, and he got it big to cause he got an education and he got to be big, and I stayed in contact with him for years. And he didn’t have no problem here and then we he finished he didn’t have no problem and he got a real good job and everything. A high-paying job cause he went for something—he was smart anyway
C: So during this time, there were no marches here in Florence?
R: I remember marching one time, and I decided to get out. Cause people started meddling with me, and they said if somebody hits you, you’re supposed to take it and I couldn’t do that.
C: That’s true you’re supposed to be non-violent
R: See I couldn’t be non-violent if somebody is hitting me.
C: So there was a march here?
R: Oh yeah, there was a march. And the preacher that was non-violent, they tell you if you can’t stand to be hit, kicked, spit on, (don’t come) and I quit.
B: So you had a preacher that was preaching non-violence?
R: It was the church next to mine. I lived on the west side, and I went to St. James. This was a preacher that preached at Mt. Moriah, just about a block away. He was the one who was heading these marches up.
C: I didn’t know there were marches here!
R: Oh yeah, but I didn’t march in but one, maybe two. But yeah there were a lot of them. Let me see if I can remember how many marches it was cause it was quite a few. Cause I would go and look at them. I don’t remember anything happening though, you know. They just marched. But they would tell you before you marched that you have to be able to accept this. It wasn’t a whole lot of people didn’t march, there was more marching than was in the crowd.
C: Do you remember anybody meddling?
R: I never did see that. But I wanted it to go right and smooth. A person like me would mess that up, so I didn’t want to mess that up. And I don’t ever remember anybody getting hit or kicked or spit on.
C: But it wasn’t like in Birmingham with dogs and fire hoses?
R: That didn’t happen here.
B: Where were these marches?
R: they marched down Court Street, the main drag.
B: So at that time, you could go in the same restaurant as white people but had to go in a different door?
R: When they were marching, I think we could go anywhere. Cause I think King had gotten the right for black people to go anywhere, but something didn’t go right so they were still marching, or something like that. I remember the marches, we were supposed to go where we want to at that time.
When I played football down there at the Coffee Stadium, we had to clean up before we could play.We had to play after they (UNA and Coffee High School) played, we couldn’t play when we wanted to. We played after Coffee and UNA. We were welcome to play but we had to go and clean it up. But I enjoyed cleaning up cause I could be out of class.
C: I just have one last question, so what do you think about the way things are now for black people in Florence?
R: Well you know my daughter, and this really shocked me, just like the people was when I was young...my daughter is catching some of the same stuff (that I got in trouble with) now. My daughter told me—she went to college, I have 2 daughters that finished college—and they got good jobs, but they still pulling crooked, and that kind of hurt me. See when I was cutting hair, I bought a nice home out where I’m living now, about 50 years ago, still living in it now. My daughters have been to college, and they haven’t even bought a home. I didn’t even go to school for barbering, and i bought a house. It would cost over $100,000 now. I have 5 kids and don’t any of them own their own homes. Cause after they got their rights, they couldn’t keep good jobs. I know one of my daughters is highly educated, and she would make about $40/hour if she could stay on the job. But they get rid of her. I got five kids, and those kids don’t even have a home. They rent. I’m talking about they got an education. They know how to not let you work. I thought when my kids finished college, that they would bypass me, with the education and the money they make. But they won’t let them make it long.
B: The only thing left I wanted to ask you is, what was the name of the preacher who was preaching non-violence and leading the marches?
R: Reverend Tolbert, he pastored Mt. Moriah
END OF INTERVIEW
Interviewer
Brian Corrigan
Camille Bennett
Camille Bennett
Interviewee
Robert Lee Johnson
Location
Trinity M.B. Church, Florence Alabama
Time Summary
00:10 to 07:40 --Early life of Robert Lee Johnson; cutting hair
07:41 to 35:00 --Segregation in Florence; discrimination; civil rights
07:41 to 35:00 --Segregation in Florence; discrimination; civil rights
Files
Collection
Citation
Johnson, Robert Lee., “Oral History: Robert Lee Johnson,” Shoals Black History, accessed April 29, 2024, https://shoalsblackhistory.omeka.net/items/show/203.